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I am experiencing increasing hostility from the SE community.

Some recent examples:

  • My perfectly valid question with 3 valid answers has been downvoted for no reason.
  • Economics beta was given exactly 9! days to evict with no prior consultation with members nor taking any proactive steps.
  • Getting data from closing site seems to be a problem if you do not have technical background.

These are just very recent examples concerning my person but I have noticed widespread hostility on SE. Things like using patronizing tone when talking to newbies, closing questions with very little or no explanation and general snobbish attitude from senior members and moderators.

What I really miss here is summarized in one of Wikipedia's founding principles: Assume good faith.

share|improve this question

closed as not constructive by Mark Trapp, Yi Jiang, jonsca, Yannis, Manishearth May 3 '12 at 10:07

As it currently stands, this question is not a good fit for our Q&A format. We expect answers to be supported by facts, references, or expertise, but this question will likely solicit debate, arguments, polling, or extended discussion. If you feel that this question can be improved and possibly reopened, visit the help center for guidance.If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.

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9! is a large number –  Manishearth May 3 '12 at 9:43
    
Hey guys! I have more question across SE that you can vote to close, don't hesitate to relieve your frustration :D –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:19
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We don't VTC for fun--we only VTC if the post deserves to be VTC'd. This post was a rant, so we VTCd it. –  Manishearth May 3 '12 at 10:22
    
@Manishearth This was not meant to be rant but a discussion. And the fact that the community treats it as a rant proves my point. One of the question I have used as example was closed for very suspicious reasons (see the comments below). Except for your answer there is a very little good will to discuss anything here. –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 11:13
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Well, it sounded rant-y, and such posts are liable to snowball into flamewars. Edit it to make it less offensive/ranty and it may be reopened. –  Manishearth May 3 '12 at 11:16
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I would say the community became less willing to fight and now closing really fast anything that is likely to cause only fight without any real value to the community. In the past such debates could last for days and cause lots of steam to be released until moderator stepped in and cleaned the mess. Now seriously - what you expect people here to say? "Yes we are more hostile" and then you can point a blaming finger? You can try and suggest ways to improve something you think is wrong and it might have better luck to survive and who knows, maybe even cause a positive change. –  Shadow Wizard May 3 '12 at 11:29

3 Answers 3

Your first question:

Why do certain programming languages use semicolon to separate code?

Is not suitable for Stack Overflow. It would be OK for Programmers - in fact it's already been asked:

Why are statements in many programming languages terminated by semicolons?

share|improve this answer
5  
I really dislike the semicolon question, it's a typical bikeshed question, but it's not false that it's more suitable for us than Stack Overflow. –  Yannis May 3 '12 at 9:54
    
@YahooAnswersenthusiast - I'm with you on that one. –  ChrisF May 3 '12 at 9:55
    
This is stackexchange About page (stackoverflow.com/about) and this is programmers About page (programmers.stackexchange.com/about). Now tell me what question goes where. Also, I am not asking that question to irritate you, I am asking it becuase I want to learn something. If you think the question is "bikeshead" you are welcome to LEAVE A COMMENT after downvoting it. –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:05
1  
@daniel.sedlacek You can check this answer for a quick overview of where you should ask programming questions. Now, my "bikeshed" comment was for the Programmers version of the question, had nothing to do with you, both I and ChrisF are Programmers moderators and were commenting on our version of the question. But I did put a link there, which more or less explains why the question is a bikeshed one, did you bother to follow it? –  Yannis May 3 '12 at 10:11
    
So now you closed that question for not being constructive? Srsly? Chris F, right here you say the question will be a fit on Programmers while actually the question asked there can not be more different. And they you vote to close my question as not constructive? Isn't this a real time example of "snobbish attitude from senior members and moderators"? –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:16
    
@daniel.sedlacek - The close reason is chosen by majority vote. So three people voted not constructive. The other two could have voted off topic or any of the other reasons. –  ChrisF May 3 '12 at 10:17
    
@YahooAnswersenthusiast thanks for the link, it's a pity it hasn't been posted as comments to that question before it was closed. Speaking of which the Programmers question asks "why semicolon and not other symbol" while I am asking "why do we need terminating symbol at all". Can't you see the difference? –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:23
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@daniel.sedlacek The difference doesn't really matter to me, I'd close both questions, they are not questions about actual practical problems, and to me that makes them unsuitable for Stack Exchange. –  Yannis May 3 '12 at 10:25
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@YahooAnswersenthusiast I didn't know SE is only for questions about "actual practical problems". Do you want me to show you couple thousand questions on SE that are not closed while not asking about "actual practical problems"? But that is not the point, my point was that you guys should assume some GOOD FAITH and communicate accordingly. If you simply close someone's question with not explanation while there are other similar questions that apparently flourish then you are being seen as hostile. –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:34
    
Guys, speaking of which, I have a nominee for closure for not asking about "actual practical problem". Hope you won't mind this question earned 81 upvotes, was protected by "Good Subjective, bad subjective" template, has awarded a bounty and it's best answer has 100 upvotes! Yes it's the question from your example: programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/139482/…. –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:45
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@daniel.sedlacek If you check the revisions, the question was closed at some point. Then we (the community) talked about it constructively, edited the question, and it was re-opened. The same process could have salvaged your question, too bad you decided to throw a fit instead. –  Yannis May 3 '12 at 11:19
    
@YahooAnswersenthusiast now it's even more funnier, the reopened question is not different from the closed one except for this sugarcoating "I want to know the history behind this decision, and hope the answers will lead to insights that may influence future decisions in the design and implementation of programming languages." While I am asking much more technical question not for the sake of studying history. I got (and accepted) valid answer from respected senior editor that really explained the technical aspect. And only now (months later) it was closed by this raid of injured seniors. –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 11:30
    
@daniel.sedlacek: "While I am asking much more technical question not for the sake of studying history." If that's true, why did you accept an answer that didn't answer your question? You wanted to know why statements need terminators. He didn't answer you. Python, for example, doesn't have statement terminators (if you don't consider line ending to be terminators). Lua allows terminators, but only requires them in certain instances. Jon Skeet's answer was much better at explaining what statement terminators are for. –  Nicol Bolas May 3 '12 at 17:33

You say

I am experiencing increasing hostility from the SE community.

(my emphasis), but you also say

I always disliked Stackexchange for it's hostility and cockyness

(again), so maybe you're just seeing what you expect to see?

share|improve this answer
    
Am I really saying that? The first sentence is a quote and you have used the blocquote format to attribute it. The second sentence is your extrapolation but you are again using blockquotes to attribute it to me. Fail. –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 9:57
    
Is the linked comment not yours?? –  AakashM May 3 '12 at 9:59
4  
@daniel.sedlacek You also say –  Yi Jiang May 3 '12 at 9:59
    
You got me, that's what I said. Except the second sentence was written in anger and is not true, I used to be a big fun of SE. But I am increasingly frustrated from the tone the community uses. –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:09
8  
@daniel.sedlacek Perhaps you should stay away from the keyboard when angry? Some of the hostility you claim to have experienced may just be just people responding to your obvious anger. Assume good faith goes both ways you know, and you don't seem to. –  Yannis May 3 '12 at 10:14

All your examples aren't exactly valid.

  • That's not "perfectly valid", it may be slightly broad since the answer depends upon the programming language. It may have been suitable for Programmers.SE, though (link stolen from @YahooAnswers).
  • A beta is a beta is a beta. Members of betas know perfectly well that their site may be closed at any moment. If all betas are meant to be permanent, we wouldn't have a beta. The proactive steps are being taken by the community, and we are salvaging posts.
  • Yes, this is sort of an issue-- I think there were sandboxen for these, but many are inactive. Remember that the SE engine is not open source, so visualization requires a whole new engine built from scratch. That's a whole lot of effort. In the meantime, use phpMyAdmin to trawl the dbs, I would say.

The general issue

It is extremely ironic that you mention Wikipedia. I used to volunteer there for a while (gonna start again), and they have this "hostility" issue much more than we do.

It's not hostility. Most people are just following the policy. Wikipedia has many more policies than we do, so the issue is more prominent there.

On SE sites, users do get scared off if they get reprimanded repeatedly (seen it happen).

Things like using patronizing tone when talking to newbies,

Well, I'm not too active on SO, but on smaller sites, this doesn't happen. On SO, I've seen some not-so-nice comments, but these usually apply to "do my work for me" questions. You can't really assume good faith here.

closing questions with very little or no explanation

The close reason is enough explanation. There is a closing blurb underneath it. If the actual reason for closing is slightly different from the CV reason, CVers should be explaining what to do to improve the question. But I'd need some examples about this.

and general snobbish attitude form senior members and moderators.

[citation needed]

And note that we do usually AGF. Just not in obvious cases. Wikipedia does this as well.

share|improve this answer
    
Snobbish attitude example: The answer above: "Your first question: Why do certain programming languages use semicolon to separate code? Is not suitable for Stack Overflow. It would be OK for Programmers - in fact it's already been asked: Why are statements in many programming languages terminated by semicolons? ChrisF". At the very same time ChrisF voted to close that question as "not being constructive". –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:38
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@daniel.sedlacek: Each site has different rules. The other issue with the question is that it is rather vague and all that. Also, he is the 4th CV-er. Usually people CV depending on already-chosen reasons. Your question can go under both "off-topic" and "not constructive" –  Manishearth May 3 '12 at 10:46
    
I don't see how it is off topic but in that case a have a nominee for closure for not asking about "actual practical problem". Hope you won't mind this question earned 81 upvotes, was protected by "Good Subjective, bad subjective" template, has awarded a bounty and it's best answer has 100 upvotes! Yes it's the question from ChrisF's example, see the answer above. –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:48
    
@daniel.sedlacek: Every site has different rules. Prog.SE is made for ths sort of question, they are disliked and not allowed on SO. –  Manishearth May 3 '12 at 10:50
    
This is stackexchange About page (stackoverflow.com/about) and this is programmers About page (programmers.stackexchange.com/about). Now tell me what question goes where. –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:51
    
Speaking of which, if you say it's a fit for Prog but not for SO then why is that question closed as not constructive instead of being migrated there? –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 10:52
    
more examples on "snobbish attitude from senior members": meta.stackexchange.com/questions/131174/… –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 11:19
    
@daniel.sedlacek: That doesn't sound snobbish to me... Where exactly is the snobbishness? –  Manishearth May 3 '12 at 11:27
    
"Yeah, okay. I read your other posts and got a little snarky. Toned it down a bit. – Brock Adams 3 mins ago". Check the revisions. –  daniel.sedlacek May 3 '12 at 11:32
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@daniel.sedlacek: Snarky, sort of. Snobbish, no. On MSO, we're all like that, we have a jokingish attitude. It may have rubbed you the wrong way :/ –  Manishearth May 3 '12 at 11:36

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