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For sites (like) Philosophy.SE and Physics.SE:

I would like to propose a tick box under a question, that makes sure that during the first, say, 24 hours, no answers will be visible to anyone (except that an answerer can see and edit his or her own answer).

It would have some benefits. Independent answers. Avoiding discussion with the first answerer. More objective voting. Comparability, also for voters. Getting some duplicates, which would indicate some consensus. No "authoritative" or massively upvoted answers one feels one has to battle with. Preventing shooting from the hip to be first. Etc, etc.

It would encourage answerers to be more diligent about their answers, such that once they all simultaneously become visible they might want to be the best among "equals".

Obviously, it would be the user with the question to select this option or not. Upvoting/downvoting on the question may proceed throughout the delay period.

Note that this would only give the option to delay the action related to the button pressing of "Post This Answer" to, say, 24 hours after the posting of the question. Nobody sees it in the meantime, not even the questioner. Answerers (and perhaps all) are notified before entering their answer that this will be the case.

24
  • 5
    Love the sentiment, hate the feature.
    – yannis
    May 20, 2013 at 18:25
  • 6
    If I ask a question I don't want to wait 24 hours for an answer.
    – juergen d
    May 20, 2013 at 18:25
  • 12
    "There are obvious drawbacks, but for the time being I'll remain silent about those." ... that is not a good start.
    – Bart
    May 20, 2013 at 18:26
  • @juergend You may choose, that's why it's a tick box.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 18:26
  • 5
    @Gugg: Then nobody will use that tick box.
    – juergen d
    May 20, 2013 at 18:26
  • @juergend I would. Say for Philosophy.SE or Physics.SE. I have time.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 18:27
  • 1
    @Gugg If you think this only applies to a few specific sites, and not SO, you should say so in your question, or even post it on the meta of those site(s). As it is, it's assumed that this would apply to all sites, and specifically SO, given where you posted it.
    – Servy
    May 20, 2013 at 18:30
  • @Servy I did and was directed here. Am I in the wrong place?
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 18:31
  • If your answer feels like it is in a "battle" with another answer who is winning all of the upvotes...most likely that answer is better. This isn't always the case, but it certainly represents the majority of the cases.
    – user7116
    May 20, 2013 at 18:33
  • 2
    @Gugg No, he wanted you to describe the drawbacks that you feel are obvious, along with how you plan to address them, or why those obvious drawbacks aren't enough of a problem to prevent the feature from being implemented, rather than ignoring them.
    – Servy
    May 20, 2013 at 19:50
  • 1
    @random It is not a duplicate. This proposal is about including a (publicly known) option, not a mandatory feature. Big difference.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 20:31
  • 2
    Why the duplicate? It isn't one: That's to prevent FGITW, this is for something else. FGITW isn't a problem at all on Phys.SE. While I'm not too fond of the proposal, it's gotten too much flak by being viewed at an SO perspective. It's not for SO. May 20, 2013 at 20:32
  • 3
    @random: Because it's not one niche site, it's a niche of many sites. Physics and philosophy are a couple, I probably can think of more. And when an issue applies to more than one site, MSO is where you come to. May 20, 2013 at 20:37
  • 2
    I bet the same would make more sense on religion sites as well. May 20, 2013 at 20:38
  • 1
    @Gugg You're not some sleezy salesman trying to sell me a crappy car by not telling me about the engineblock that will most likely fall out as soon as I leave the lot. You are trying to discuss a feature request with the community. If you see downsides, list them. Don't make us guess. If you tell me "I have this idea, though I see these downsides", we would happily think with you how to address them while taking your idea as the basis if there is something useful there. It's not a cheap shot. If anything it made me think "well, he doesn't think it's a good idea anyway".
    – Bart
    May 20, 2013 at 20:41

2 Answers 2

7

Interpreting your question to apply only to hand-picked substacks and be opt-in, I still see a deluge of problems and no benefits. Working through them:

I would like to propose a tick box under a question, that makes sure that during the first, say, 24 hours, no answers will be visible to anyone (except that an answerer can see and edit his or her own answer).

But no one will use this, and if someone does use this, then it almost certainly is a bad question. Questions should be regarding actual, real problems the user faces. Not problems the user might face in 24 hours. SE is not a venue for questioners to mediate discussions on various topics.

Furthermore I don't want to deal with the deluge of questions from users asking why they don't have a solution to their problem yet, and having to muster the sincerity to graciously explain, "Because you clicked the box that says I don't want an answer yet. If you didn't want an answer right now, then why did you do that?"

Even making this opt-in, it's a feature whose accidental and misunderstood uses will do more harm than when users want to use it deliberately, which also is problematic.

Independent answers.

I literally don't see how this is a benefit. SE problems are not and are never brainstorm-oriented. They're problem-solution oriented. Multiple creative solutions or collaboration are not the goal of > 99% of questions on any SE site.

Getting some duplicates, which would indicate some consensus.

No. Upvotes indicate consensus. This is tried and tested. Very, very often the best answer is somewhat subtle or brilliant and upvotes rush in behind it, because upvoters are competent enough to evaluate but not brilliant enough to come up with it. (P v. NP, if you will.)

Avoiding discussion with the first answerer.

No. Discussion includes two things: asking for clarification and pointing out areas of improvement. Often a first answer will have an error that is caught by someone else who might have thought about answering. Users who opt-in to this feature will be hurting themselves here without even necessarily realizing it.

No "authoritative" or massively upvoted answers one feels one has to battle with.

There are two problems with this. Firstly, it's wrong. If the highest-voted answer is not useful to me but the second is... I just have to scroll down the page very slightly more. The first answer is not some video game boss standing in the way If that is a problem one experiences on an SE site then the SE site is rotten and needs to be thrown away.

Secondly, we want that authority. Firstly, for the utility of future visitors. That is a big part of our mission; to create a long-term repo of Q/A. Secondly-secondly, for exactly the fact outlined above - to indicate consensus.

It would encourage answerers to be more diligent about their answers

Wrong. Downvotes do that. Peer review does that. Obscured answers will do the opposite.

Even limiting to math or physics and even making it opt-in and even exposing the answers to the questioner earlier, I still don't see any benefit; just a bunch of consequences that deteriorate the quality of our site.

Furthermore -

  • if you implement this so questioner has pre-emptive access evil information can be planted without review for an hour. A bigger problem on SO where an attacker can literally convince the OP to inject attack code.
  • Poor coverage across all questions, too much duplicated effort
  • Questions that are 24 hours old tend to already be in their "long term / historical value" stage.
  • Duplicated questions in the 24 hour time period that we can't do anything about since the answers are privatized until then
  • The benefit of this is totally unclear to the vast majority of users, who want answers now, not to tap into the benefits you perceive (and I disagree with)
  • Does not scale to less "close-knit" communities where the majority of users want answers now and fast
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  • 1
    I don't think you got the suggestion I tried to make. :(
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 18:33
  • Everybody can answer, but the answers only become visible 24 hours after the posting of the question.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 18:33
  • Also to the questioner.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 18:34
  • 2
    (1) deals with only the questioner seeing it. And beyond that I have no idea why you think requiring all questions wait a day to have answers shown will not completely destroy this site and let a competitor take over in a week.
    – djechlin
    May 20, 2013 at 18:35
  • "We're like SO, only 24 hours faster!" a working tagline already.
    – djechlin
    May 20, 2013 at 18:35
  • I proposed a tick box, an option to the questioner. Not an obligation.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 18:37
  • 2
    oic. Then no one would use it since they would rather have a fast answer. And the ones who do are saying "I don't want anyone to help with the proposed answers no matter how wrong or dangerous they are." I don't like features that let people hurt themselves. What about literally anyone else who has that problem? They also have to wait a day before it becomes useful to them?
    – djechlin
    May 20, 2013 at 18:39
  • "[D]angerous","people hurt themselves"? I really don't follow. Your last point is one of the things I thought of myself, but it isn't really an issue on sites like Philosophy, Mathematics and Physics.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 18:47
  • @Gugg So on those three sites it's not possible to post an answer that appears, at first glance, or to someone unfamiliar with the field, to answer the question or solve the problem, perhaps working when applied to a few simple examples, but that breaks down and fails when applied to non-trivial examples of the problem in question, or that generates negative side effects that aren't obvious at first glance or to a novice in the field? I doubt that's the case, even on those sites, although it is a bigger problem on sites like SO.
    – Servy
    May 20, 2013 at 18:52
  • 1
    @Servy On Physics.SE and Philosophy.SE many answers miss on some subtleties, although they might be "good enough" for most purposes. And they are not always corrected by comments. However, with this mechanism, some of those subtleties may instantly (24 hours after the posting of the question) appear in some answer, which would otherwise had not been given.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 18:59
  • On any SE site I've ever been on answers with any noticeable problem tended to be noticed rather quickly, commented on, and then downvoted. The author is also given the opportunity to fix the post right away if the error isn't fundamental. If it's not shown a day later it's less likely for readers to notice the answer to respond quickly, and the author is much less likely be on to quickly respond to such comments.
    – Servy
    May 20, 2013 at 19:03
  • @Gugg answer updated to work through your question in detail
    – djechlin
    May 20, 2013 at 19:03
  • @djechlin Great, thanks! BTW, I don't think I suggested "even exposing the answers to the questioner earlier". Certainly not what I had in mind.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 19:06
  • 1
    @djechlin I really think you should remove your concerns about the questioner having access to answers that others can't see. I did not suggest that.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 20:01
  • @Gugg at your insistence, see edit.
    – djechlin
    May 20, 2013 at 20:13
3

This would often lead to a mass of duplicate answers. When I go to answer on StackOverflow, I first check the existing answers to see if any of them give the same answer (and if so, I vote it up instead of giving my own answer). If no one could tell whether their answer had already been posted, they would probably just post it again- you could get 5-10 or even more duplicates of the same answer.

You seem to view this as a good thing:

Getting some duplicates, which would indicate some consensus.

But there's already a way to measure consensus on an answer- upvotes! If everyone agrees that there's one right answer, they'll usually upvote that answer, which is a much more concise way to recognize consensus than having to read through a dozen answers and figure out which is the most common.

12
  • Yes, and answerers may ignore "ticked" question if they please. But the major benefit would be that any answers would be independent.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 19:01
  • 1
    Also note that many questions on Philosophy.SE and Physics.SE are not settled at all.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 19:02
  • 2
    Plenty of very simple and easy to answer questions get 5-10 answers in the first few minutes as it is. Using this format very simple and easy to answer questions could easy get 50+ answers over the course of a whole day. Trying to read through them all and sort out the 45 duplicates from the 5 posts that go above and beyond to have really fantastic content would be a nightmare. Very few would actually bother to read through even a significant percentage of the answers.
    – Servy
    May 20, 2013 at 19:05
  • 1
    @Servy Those answer rates are completely alien to the sites I'm concerned with (see the top of my question).
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 19:08
  • 2
    @Gugg Well, I just saw this question with 19 answers right on the homepage of mathematics. And that's only spread out over the course of a few days; it's not like the question is over a year old. Such questions may be less common on those sites, but they do happen.
    – Servy
    May 20, 2013 at 19:11
  • 1
    @Servy Mathematics.SE is much more "populated" than Physics.SE. And Physics.SE is much more "populated" than Philosophy.SE. I can imagine that you're not putting in the effort for a better answer if there's already an accepted one (which for most purposes is correct) on a sparsely populated site. But it is a "free" mechanism. You don't need to put the tick there. And you don't need to answer a "ticked" question.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 19:19
  • 1
    @Gugg To justify adding a feature you'll need to indicate that it would be a) used b) beneficial when used c) not be abused, or otherwise cause significant problems if improperly used d) have an even better net benefit, all things considered, than any other unimplemented functionality the devs could built in that time. Arguing that most people just wouldn't use it means you're not even getting past a). It's still sounding that you just need to use a bounty.
    – Servy
    May 20, 2013 at 19:23
  • @Servy Obviously I cannot know d. I will use it, that's a. b, I think I argued for. c I don't get. Essentially, it blocks the button "post answer" (or whatever it is called) for 24 hours since the question was posted (and then automatically pushes it).
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 19:29
  • 1
    @Gugg You yourself are saying in response to virtually every argument against your suggestion that that's a case where it simply shouldn't be used. That means that if someone did use it in that case it would result in C; very bad things happening if someone used your suggestion when you think they shouldn't have. You should be arguing that lots of people would want to use this; not just you. So far the only benefits you've described sound like they're exactly the results of using a bounty; I'd suggest leveraging that functionality.
    – Servy
    May 20, 2013 at 19:32
  • 1
    @Servy I did say no such thing. Good enough for most purposes in Physics and Philosophy, sometimes means plain wrong (but not of the immediate interest of the questioner or current followers). Many answers on Physics and Philosophy are quick-fix like. They get accepted and nobody looks at them again. Until somebody does, and then, perhaps, they turn out to be wrong, or, otherwise, somebody gets the wrong idea.
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 19:44
  • 1
    @Gugg And why will not showing them for 24 hours result in additional attention being drawn to them? Most attention for answers is in response to them being posted; that draws attention. If they aren't shown at that time you're missing out on the best opportunity to get feedback. If "the best opportunity" isn't good enough then there simply isn't enough traffic on the site. I don't see this fixing that problem.
    – Servy
    May 20, 2013 at 19:48
  • 1
    @Servy Obviously, the question is being posed, but with the marker that says "Your answer will only be visible to other people at 11.23 AM tomorrow". It will draw the attention of specialists, of whom there are few on the sites I mentioned within, say 24 hours. Knowing that they are specialists they might consider answer fully, which they might not do if there already is an answer sufficient for the answerer. (BTW, I'm deeply impressed with the traffic on this meta-site. It's really incomparable to some other sites.)
    – Řídící
    May 20, 2013 at 19:54

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